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| Should R2 Update Its News And Travel Jingles? |
| Yes |
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| No |
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Behind Geddon's Wall
Joined: 11 Dec 2006
Posts: 1553
Location: Kingston Upon Hull/ The Cloud Factory
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 Posted: Thu May 10, 2007 2:35 pm Post subject: |
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I think we are all agreed that radio 2 sets the braodcasting standard, like the Gold standard. Therefore it is unwise to change the standard be it in jingle, programs or presenters.
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Ian Robinson
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Joined: 11 Dec 2006
Posts: 3609
Location: Chorley, Lancashire
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| Posted: Thu May 10, 2007 2:42 pm Post subject: |
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It's not true that things only rebrand because they're failing - it's just that those are the ones you tend to notice. Marathon was renamed to bring it in line with the global marketing plans of Mars, Inc. (thank goodness they didn't replace "Twix" with "Raiders") but sales were fine. Market leaders in all fields constantly refresh their image to stay top of the game.
BBC1 is the UK's most popular TV channel and yet they just completely changed their look. So that they can stay top of the heap, and strengthen their brand with the expansion of Digital services. I see no reason why Radio 2 shouldn't do the same.
I don't know why it would be "cheap" and "loud" - nothing suggests it would be. By "fresh" I mean the jingles should stop sounding so 80s and more reflect the music being played on Radio 2. Perhaps the same tune played by different bands to reflect the diversity - there could be Glam, New Romantic, Rock, Jazz, Big Band versions and so on.
As Mark is keen to tell us, most radio jingles for most radio stations are made by the same few companies. And let's be honest, it's hack work. They churn out the same stuff over and over. Occasionally someone like Chris Evans will get something different from them but generally they follow the same format - whether it's Radio 2 or Grimsby Rock FM.
So why should Radio 2 sound the same as those? The station doesn't, and obviously there's something about the station that brings us here and not to ILRs. The jingle, the station's identifying sound, should show that. It should say "Radio 2: ignore the imposters. Our music's great, we love our listeners, and we're bloody brilliant" |
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mcl
Joined: 04 Feb 2007
Posts: 127
Location: Somewhere in the South
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| Posted: Thu May 10, 2007 3:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Ian Robinson wrote: | | Perhaps the same tune played by different bands to reflect the diversity - there could be Glam, New Romantic, Rock, Jazz, Big Band versions and so on. |
I think the previous set of jingles, the old 'It's all for you - Radio 2' package did just that - well, no New Romantic version, but that kind of thing! There was a big band one, one with a string quartet for the poncy programmes, a Swingle Singers style version.....John Dunn and Jimmy Young even had special versions which worked their old signature tunes into the melody, which were quite well done.
I much preferred those jingles to the present lot, to be honest - I'd support a change purely down to the fact that the 'Beeee-beeee-ceeeeee.....Radio 2' tune they use at the moment annoys the hell out of me!
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Lady Boil De Spudswell
Joined: 12 Dec 2006
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Location: Location, Location
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| Posted: Thu May 10, 2007 4:11 pm Post subject: |
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| mcl wrote: | | Ian Robinson wrote: | | Perhaps the same tune played by different bands to reflect the diversity - there could be Glam, New Romantic, Rock, Jazz, Big Band versions and so on. |
I think the previous set of jingles, the old 'It's all for you - Radio 2' package did just that - well, no New Romantic version, but that kind of thing! There was a big band one, one with a string quartet for the poncy programmes, a Swingle Singers style version.....John Dunn and Jimmy Young even had special versions which worked their old signature tunes into the melody, which were quite well done.
I much preferred those jingles to the present lot, to be honest - I'd support a change purely down to the fact that the 'Beeee-beeee-ceeeeee.....Radio 2' tune they use at the moment annoys the hell out of me! |
Yes! There's a 'tweeness' about that chord progression which now sits awkwardly with their new found hipness. I'm thinking back to some of the older jingle chord progressions (early 80's packages) and they worked a lot better and would sound more contemporary and cool if used today.
The 1986 set was also well orchestrated. I remember spending the whole day by the radio listening in awe as everybody had a brand spanking new jingle! It was a completely new package and thoughtfully produced. Particularly liked Ray Moore's 'Start The Day With' one and Gloria had one that incorporated her old sig tune which worked quite well.
Happy days.
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mark occomore
Joined: 07 Dec 2006
Posts: 9955
Location: UK
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| Posted: Thu May 10, 2007 4:56 pm Post subject: |
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| I did email groove addicts last year and asked if they are going to update their jingles and they did say they were talking to radio 2. Thats when they made the new ID jingles for Richard, Pete etc etc.. |
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Mark Mayhew
Joined: 11 Dec 2006
Posts: 2897
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| Posted: Thu May 10, 2007 7:03 pm Post subject: |
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I am clearly in the minority here on the subject of jingles.
I think it's very important to have a "refresh" of the whole jingle package every so often. I certainly think a good set jingles enhances the listening experience of good radio.
I am not sure if I have mentioned it before but I'm a big Richard Allinson fan.
Richard's daily show on BFBS Radio 2 has just undergone an update of the jingle package for his show. When he started the jingles were of a kind which i would describe as retro. They have just been updated to what I would call a "big band style". Personally I love the jingles on Richard's show-they really enhance the enjoyment of tuning in.
I agree completly with Lady B De S-the current jingles usedf or Radio 2 are so outdated-I can't possibly believe they would cost that much to be given a complete makeover. From the poll put up on this message board about this it does strike me that a lot of you message boarders don't like/do change very well with regard to Radio 2. |
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Toggy tea slurper
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| Posted: Thu May 10, 2007 7:52 pm Post subject: |
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| Mark Mayhew wrote: |
I am not sure if I have mentioned it before but I'm a big Richard Allinson fan.
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Really? I never knew!  |
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gfloyd
Joined: 07 Dec 2006
Posts: 4861
Location: Here, There, Everywhere.
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| Posted: Thu May 10, 2007 7:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Toggy tea slurper wrote: | | Mark Mayhew wrote: |
I am not sure if I have mentioned it before but I'm a big Richard Allinson fan.
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Really? I never knew! |
No I don't recall Mark saying that either. I'm intrigued by Allinson's "big band style" jingles on BFBS. I just might have to listen to a bit of the show to find out how they sound.
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Cherskiy
Joined: 08 Dec 2006
Posts: 3701
Location: near Amble, Northumberland
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| Posted: Thu May 10, 2007 8:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Mark Mayhew wrote: |
I am not sure if I have mentioned it before but I'm a big Richard Allinson fan.
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Seriously?
Seriously - I don't like change for change's sake, which seems to me to be the reason why many things are changed on the network. I do change just dandy, thanks - when it is required. The travel jingles, AFAIC, are so low on my list of "Things to do if I ever became Controller of R2" that they're practically underground. 
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mark occomore
Joined: 07 Dec 2006
Posts: 9955
Location: UK
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| Posted: Thu May 10, 2007 8:16 pm Post subject: |
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| Mark Mayhew wrote: |
I am not sure if I have mentioned it before but I'm a big Richard Allinson fan.
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Never had guessed!! I used to be a fan of all the ex radio 1 DJ's, glad they didn't have a forum then |
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mcl
Joined: 04 Feb 2007
Posts: 127
Location: Somewhere in the South
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| Posted: Thu May 10, 2007 11:23 pm Post subject: |
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| Lady Boil De Spudswell wrote: | Yes! There's a 'tweeness' about that chord progression which now sits awkwardly with their new found hipness. I'm thinking back to some of the older jingle chord progressions (early 80's packages) and they worked a lot better and would sound more contemporary and cool if used today.
The 1986 set was also well orchestrated. I remember spending the whole day by the radio listening in awe as everybody had a brand spanking new jingle! It was a completely new package and thoughtfully produced. Particularly liked Ray Moore's 'Start The Day With' one and Gloria had one that incorporated her old sig tune which worked quite well.
Happy days. |
Nice to see we're of a similar mindset! Was the 1986 package the 'It's All For You' ones? I wasn't listening to R2 in 86, so I can't really judge. Gloria H's jingle used a fragment of Herb Alpert's arrangement of 'A Taste of Honey', I think - it's immortalised in her Noel's House Party Gotcha, when her producer takes a dislike to the Peggy Lee record she's playing, whips it off the turntable and snaps it in front of her......Glo's face is an absolute picture!
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Fred
Joined: 04 Apr 2007
Posts: 225
Location: Cirencester, Gloucestershire
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 6:40 am Post subject: Re: Should R2 Update Its News And Travel Jingles? |
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| Lady Boil De Spudswell wrote: | | They have both been in service now for a whopping QUARTER of the entire time R2 has been on the air! |
Radio 2 obviously seem to be pleased with them. I don't really care what the jingles sound like but if Radio 2 seem happy with them then why change them?
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Mark Mayhew
Joined: 11 Dec 2006
Posts: 2897
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 7:25 am Post subject: |
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Ernie-If you feel so inclined and want to listen to some of the jingles on Richard's show, can I suggest you tune in right at the beginning of one of his shows-the best big band jingle I referred to earlier is usually played straight after the news by way of introduction to the 2 hour show.
Of course you might then want to stayed tuned for the rest of 2 hours-you will enjoy the experience I feel sure. |
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Lady Boil De Spudswell
Joined: 12 Dec 2006
Posts: 429
Location: Location, Location
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 8:26 am Post subject: Re: Should R2 Update Its News And Travel Jingles? |
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| Fred wrote: | | Lady Boil De Spudswell wrote: | | They have both been in service now for a whopping QUARTER of the entire time R2 has been on the air! |
Radio 2 obviously seem to be pleased with them. I don't really care what the jingles sound like but if Radio 2 seem happy with them then why change them? |
You know what, I actually believe it's got nothing to do with them being happy with them, I actually believe it's laziness. I don't think they've given it any thought! And when you've got a controller doing three jobs it's probably understandable how it's got overlooked! Doesn't mean they shouldn't be reviewed though. Name me one other station that's kept their News and Travel jingles - their most-played jingles - for longer than ten years!
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Mark Mayhew
Joined: 11 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 8:44 am Post subject: |
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| Bingo-100% spot on. |
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Lady Boil De Spudswell
Joined: 12 Dec 2006
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Location: Location, Location
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 9:28 am Post subject: |
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| Mark Mayhew wrote: | | Bingo-100% spot on. |
NB: Those two jingles have been in service LONGER than Tony Blair has been Prime Minister!!
John Major was still in power when they were first heard!
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Toggy tea slurper
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 9:35 am Post subject: |
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Still can't believe people are so bothered about a jingle  |
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Lady Boil De Spudswell
Joined: 12 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 9:50 am Post subject: |
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| Toggy tea slurper wrote: | | Still can't believe people are so bothered about a jingle |
Someone has to be! R2 clearly aren't! It's basic production etiquette to refresh jingles every few years to enhance the station sound, image and profile, but TEN?!
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Toggy tea slurper
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 9:53 am Post subject: |
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| Seriously who cares, I know you do but I don't even notice them and I certianly don't lay awake at night thinking about them |
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Lady Boil De Spudswell
Joined: 12 Dec 2006
Posts: 429
Location: Location, Location
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 10:21 am Post subject: |
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| Toggy tea slurper wrote: | | Seriously who cares, I know you do but I don't even notice them and I certianly don't lay awake at night thinking about them |
On a station that does the same thing, plays the same thing every day, I can understand there might not be such a need. But on a station like R2 which is evolving and has evolved incredibly over the last ten years, it makes quite an important musical statement about what it's doing and where it's going, every single hour!
I'm sure most listeners, like yourself, don't notice and couldn't care less, but that doesn't mean the News and Travel jingles shouldn't be looked at periodically to reflect and put a stamp on its evolution.
A new listener could be forgiven for thinking they are still doing the same things they were doing ten years ago. 'They've got the same News and Travel jingles they had in 1997 - why should anything else have changed?!' Musically or otherwise.
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Cherskiy
Joined: 08 Dec 2006
Posts: 3701
Location: near Amble, Northumberland
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 2:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Lady Boil De Spudswell wrote: | | A new listener could be forgiven for thinking they are still doing the same things they were doing ten years ago. 'They've got the same News and Travel jingles they had in 1997 - why should anything else have changed?!' Musically or otherwise. |
How would a new listener realise that they have the same jingles they had ten years ago?
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mcl
Joined: 04 Feb 2007
Posts: 127
Location: Somewhere in the South
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 3:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Lady Boil De Spudswell wrote: | | It's basic production etiquette to refresh jingles every few years to enhance the station sound, image and profile, but TEN?! |
Indeed - speaking as someone who's vaguely involved in the commercial sector, to have a jingle package lasting ten years is practically unheard of these days. Even on the little commercial stations I work for, the average shelf life of a jingle package is around five years, and even then that's stretching it a bit......and these are stations that have about a tenth of the audience and none of the licence payers cash to take for granted.
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Rachel
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 3:12 pm Post subject: |
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Commercial Radio is for advertisers, that is why they constantly update things, the advertisers expect updated images cos they think it will sell more of whatever it is they are selling. It doesn't work: advertisers are idiots who live in a dream world. Don't get sucked into it.
Commericial Radio is just the on air version of the Yellow Pages! |
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Lady Boil De Spudswell
Joined: 12 Dec 2006
Posts: 429
Location: Location, Location
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 3:34 pm Post subject: |
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| Cherskiy wrote: | | Lady Boil De Spudswell wrote: | | A new listener could be forgiven for thinking they are still doing the same things they were doing ten years ago. 'They've got the same News and Travel jingles they had in 1997 - why should anything else have changed?!' Musically or otherwise. |
How would a new listener realise that they have the same jingles they had ten years ago? |
They tuned-in in 1997 - Heard Jimmy Young and left! They returned in 2007, heard the same News jingle - and left!
"What's all the fuss about? They're still using the same bloody news ident! Jimmy Young's probably still on the station somewhere then! I'm off!"
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Lady Boil De Spudswell
Joined: 12 Dec 2006
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Location: Location, Location
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 3:40 pm Post subject: |
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| mcl wrote: | | Lady Boil De Spudswell wrote: | | It's basic production etiquette to refresh jingles every few years to enhance the station sound, image and profile, but TEN?! |
Indeed - speaking as someone who's vaguely involved in the commercial sector, to have a jingle package lasting ten years is practically unheard of these days. Even on the little commercial stations I work for, the average shelf life of a jingle package is around five years, and even then that's stretching it a bit......and these are stations that have about a tenth of the audience and none of the licence payers cash to take for granted. |
It really doesn't matter what your opinion of the actual jingle is, the fact is mcl is right. Jingles - especially ones played as frequently as News and Travel - have a shelf life of about five years max! Anyone in radio will tell you this. I actually find it a bit shameful therefore that the UK's most popular station is still using two that are ten years old!
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nod
Joined: 24 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 6:16 pm Post subject: |
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Let's have some new jingles like the Manic Street Preacher one for O'Deary
Only joking really, I'm quite happy with the current jingles, they serve their purpose to indicate the travel is coming on etc..that's all I need. They certainly don't get much interest from me and affect how I feel about the station, whether 5, 10 or 25 years old. |
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Triumph Herald
Joined: 22 Mar 2007
Posts: 85
Location: Bucks
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 6:44 pm Post subject: |
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| Lady Boil De Spudswell wrote: | | The 1986 set was also well orchestrated. I remember spending the whole day by the radio listening in awe as everybody had a brand spanking new jingle! It was a completely new package and thoughtfully produced. |
It was expensive and it showed! They spent about £30k on that big 1986 package. With all the cuts in spending at the beeb I wonder if it's money that's stopping them renewing the jingles? |
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Mark Mayhew
Joined: 11 Dec 2006
Posts: 2897
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 7:50 pm Post subject: |
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Sorry Rachel-with regard to your message posted on this thread at 3.12pm you are talking out of your arse- advertisers are certainly not living in a dream world I can assure you of that-can you use such a naughty word like arse on this message board by the way-I'm never sure.
Is a ban looming. |
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SantaFefan
Joined: 07 Dec 2006
Posts: 11258
Location: top of the cliffs in Norfolk
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 8:01 pm Post subject: |
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Not sure about that Mark, but I certainly wouldn't use it whilst referring to Rachel.... tsk tsk...
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Ian Robinson
Site Admin
Joined: 11 Dec 2006
Posts: 3609
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 8:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Mark Mayhew wrote: | | can you use such a naughty word like arse on this message board by the way-I'm never sure. |
Well you're certainly making a good effort of testing the limits. I think you should be more respectful to other posters. Rachel and I aren't seeing eye-to-eye on this subject but I certainly wouldn't want to insult her. Are you trying to get yourself banned? |
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Mark Mayhew
Joined: 11 Dec 2006
Posts: 2897
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 8:51 pm Post subject: |
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Not all Ian.
However I worked in the advertising/PR sector as a senior professional for over 12 years-it really annoys me tha people come on thesemessage and spout total drivel when they haven't a clue what they are talking about.
People should evidence their wild statements like "advertisers are idiots who live in a dream world"-this is total nonsense/very wide of the mark.
Perhaps Rachel would care to run her statement by Martin Sorrell for his comments. |
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Lady Boil De Spudswell
Joined: 12 Dec 2006
Posts: 429
Location: Location, Location
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2007 10:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Triumph Herald wrote: | | Lady Boil De Spudswell wrote: | | The 1986 set was also well orchestrated. I remember spending the whole day by the radio listening in awe as everybody had a brand spanking new jingle! It was a completely new package and thoughtfully produced. |
It was expensive and it showed! They spent about £30k on that big 1986 package. With all the cuts in spending at the beeb I wonder if it's money that's stopping them renewing the jingles? |
30k? Wow! However...
I can name numerous R2 jingles I've come across in my time, via jingle websites and other sources, that have been commissioned, composed, produced, recorded and paid for, but never used! 'Epic' was part of that 30k package and is probably the best, most over the top jingle R2 ever had. A lot of production too went in to it I shouldn't wonder. It was like Star Wars meets Superman. Just superb. I heard Ray Moore use it twice! Never again anywhere on the station!
I could quote you several other examples. The Wake Up To Wogan one that Groove did recently. Used occasionally for trails, but never by Wogan himself. If they can be this cavalier surely a few bob on News and Travel jingles they'll use a million times a day for another ten years is going to be money well spent.
(NB: Just thought, re several other examples. On Chris Evans first Saturday show he played about three or four new Chris Evans jingles that have never been used since!)
(NB2!: Sarah Kennedy had jingles too, but steadfastly refused to play 'em! Money well spent??)
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firewirefred
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| Posted: Sat May 12, 2007 12:17 am Post subject: |
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| Jingles are an old fashioned idea anyhow, especially the ones that are sung. You only have to listen to yer average BBC Radio Sticksville jingles to realise that they are pretty naff these days. I think we have never heard jingles as good as the BigL Radio London jingles from the 60s - and even they were a cobbled together version of those created by PAMS for KLIF Dallas on which BigL was based. |
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mark occomore
Joined: 07 Dec 2006
Posts: 9955
Location: UK
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| Posted: Sat May 12, 2007 7:38 am Post subject: |
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| firewirefred wrote: | | Jingles are an old fashioned idea anyhow, especially the ones that are sung. You only have to listen to yer average BBC Radio Sticksville jingles to realise that they are pretty naff these days. I think we have never heard jingles as good as the BigL Radio London jingles from the 60s - and even they were a cobbled together version of those created by PAMS for KLIF Dallas on which BigL was based. |
I think the best ones ever were the old Radio 1 Pams.
I think radio 2 are keeping them as they go along with the image of radio 2. I know it would be nice to hear some new ones, but " If they an't broke' as someone mentioned in this thread.. |
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Rachel
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| Posted: Sat May 12, 2007 7:57 am Post subject: |
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| Mark Mayhew wrote: | Not all Ian.
However I worked in the advertising/PR sector as a senior professional for over 12 years-it really annoys me tha people come on thesemessage and spout total drivel when they haven't a clue what they are talking about.
People should evidence their wild statements like "advertisers are idiots who live in a dream world"-this is total nonsense/very wide of the mark.
Perhaps Rachel would care to run her statement by Martin Sorrell for his comments. |
Just for you Mark.
1. Your washing machine breaks down half way through its cycle, do you?
a. Tune into your ILR and wait for a Domestic Appliance firm’s Advert to come on, and then ring them?
b. Look in your Yellow Pages and call a local one from in there?
2. Your car breaks down in the middle of nowhere. Do you?
a. Tune into the local ILR and wait for Breakdown Recovery Service Advert to come on, and then call them?
b. Call the AA?
3. It’s Bank Holiday Monday. Do you?
a. Get a notebook and pencil, tune into your ILR and jot down the numbers of all the advertisers, just in case you ever need them?
b. Tune into Radio 2 and relax?
1A. Well everyone is allowed to make a mistake.
2As. Be careful, you’re getting sucked in.
3As. It’s too late, you’re probably in advertising. Tune into your local ILR and wait for an Advert Addiction service to advertise, and then call them. |
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nod
Joined: 24 Dec 2006
Posts: 3558
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| Posted: Sat May 12, 2007 7:58 am Post subject: |
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| Ian Robinson wrote: | | Mark Mayhew wrote: | | can you use such a naughty word like arse on this message board by the way-I'm never sure. |
Well you're certainly making a good effort of testing the limits. I think you should be more respectful to other posters. Rachel and I aren't seeing eye-to-eye on this subject but I certainly wouldn't want to insult her. Are you trying to get yourself banned? |
well said, what are the rules on insulting others on here ? |
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Fred
Joined: 04 Apr 2007
Posts: 225
Location: Cirencester, Gloucestershire
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| Posted: Sat May 12, 2007 8:14 am Post subject: |
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| Lady Boil De Spudswell wrote: | | The Wake Up To Wogan one that Groove did recently. Used occasionally for trails, but never by Wogan himself. |
That was Wise Buddah who made that - not Groove.
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Lady Boil De Spudswell
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| Posted: Sat May 12, 2007 8:39 am Post subject: |
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| Fred wrote: | | Lady Boil De Spudswell wrote: | | The Wake Up To Wogan one that Groove did recently. Used occasionally for trails, but never by Wogan himself. |
That was Wise Buddah who made that - not Groove. |
I wondered who'd be the first to spot that, Wilson!
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Who Can Take A Sunrise, Sprinkle It With Dew... |
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nod
Joined: 24 Dec 2006
Posts: 3558
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| Posted: Sat May 12, 2007 8:44 am Post subject: |
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| nod wrote: | | Ian Robinson wrote: | | Mark Mayhew wrote: | | can you use such a naughty word like arse on this message board by the way-I'm never sure. |
Well you're certainly making a good effort of testing the limits. I think you should be more respectful to other posters. Rachel and I aren't seeing eye-to-eye on this subject but I certainly wouldn't want to insult her. Are you trying to get yourself banned? |
well said, what are the rules on insulting others on here ? |
found them....
Posted: Sat Dec 23, 2006 3:07 pm Post subject: General Forum Rules
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1. No thread should result in personal insults, either regarding presenters or fellow posters. |
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Mark Mayhew
Joined: 11 Dec 2006
Posts: 2897
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| Posted: Sat May 12, 2007 9:13 am Post subject: |
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| Noddy-Were you a teachers pet at school when you were young? |
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