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iphone keeping tabs

 
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Rachel
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2011 7:18 am    Post subject: iphone keeping tabs Reply with quote

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/tech/hardware/apple-iphone-secretly-tracking-users-privacy-security-researcher/articleshow/8045255.cms

I see that water is getting warmer, Colin. Wink Prawn Cocktail anyone?
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RockitRon



Joined: 07 Dec 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2011 7:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That doesn't surprise me in the least. In fact if it's only Apple who are able to track the location, data and conversations of an iphone I'd be surprised.
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Ian Robinson
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2011 7:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As an iPhone owner I'm not suprised either - especially as they pretty much tell you that's what they do IN THE MANUAL.

Another non-story that we're all supposed to be shocked by. The iPhone has a much-publicised "find my phone" feature that allows you to track it if it gets lost or stolen, even while switched off. How did people think that worked? Spy Pigeons?
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Rachel
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2011 9:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ian Robinson wrote:
As an iPhone owner I'm not suprised either - especially as they pretty much tell you that's what they do IN THE MANUAL.

Another non-story that we're all supposed to be shocked by. The iPhone has a much-publicised "find my phone" feature that allows you to track it if it gets lost or stolen, even while switched off. How did people think that worked? Spy Pigeons?


"Find my phone" is all very well, if it tells you where your phone is now, right this minute- which it does, but it also records and stores where it was yesterday and the day before etc- why does it do that? If you lose your phone , it's no use at all knowing where it was 6 months ago- you knew that already- it was in your pocket! Put an embedded data packet-sniffer on your iphone.... then tell me it's a non-story.
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Ian Robinson
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2011 9:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rachel wrote:
Put an embedded data packet-sniffer on your iphone.... then tell me it's a non-story.

It's a non-story because it's not a surprise. It's like being shocked at the Pope giving Easter Mass.

Whether it's right or wrong is another matter. (Personally, I'm not bothered).
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ColinB
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2011 9:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rachel, you're being a bit naive here. It's not the device that's the problem here it's the way the cellular communications system works, especially if the device has GSM features built in. So, we can safely assume that ANY mobile communications device is trackable in this way.

My first mobile phone was an NEC11A ETACS car phone on Vodafone back in 1987. That was trackable, too!

As Ian correctly says, this is a non-story. If you're worried about being watched by Big Brother why are you using the internet? And do subscribers to Sky's satellite services know that their every channel switch is logged by the Murdoch Mafia?

That's technology. That's life...........
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Rachel
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2011 10:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ColinB wrote:
Rachel, you're being a bit naive here. It's not the device that's the problem here it's the way the cellular communications system works, especially if the device has GSM features built in. So, we can safely assume that ANY mobile communications device is trackable in this way.

My first mobile phone was an NEC11A ETACS car phone on Vodafone back in 1987. That was trackable, too!

As Ian correctly says, this is a non-story. If you're worried about being watched by Big Brother why are you using the internet? And do subscribers to Sky's satellite services know that their every channel switch is logged by the Murdoch Mafia?

That's technology. That's life...........


No not really. If you have complete faith in the technolgy , then when it shows that you've been somewhere that you shouldn't, then what- do you say, It wasn't me guv honest, this technology - you know you just can't trust it.

A bad person might manipulate your whereabouts data to make it look like you were robbing a bank- you end up in the slammer- cos we have total faith in the technology- " hack into our code and manipulate the data - it's just not possible" Oh yes it is sweetheart- it's a bog standard data file.

Yeah I know pretty much all mobile phones track where they are in real time but they don't store it in a unsecure file for ever more on the phone or your PC - they store it elsewhere though. Smile I'm not worried about being tracked, I carry a sat fix tracker with me, around my neck, there's one in my car and one in my handbag too. Hubby likes to know where I am just in case I go missing.

SKY- not under these trees! Humph! Smile
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ruddlescat



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PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2011 6:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rachel - there's a feature about this subject right now on Channel Four News

If you aren't watching you can catch it again on the Channel 4 + 1 channel if you understand what I'm saying
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Rachel
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2011 11:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, Rudds, we caught the end of it. 'Tis good to know that the largest independent news broadcaster didnít think that it was a non-story. It was on Jezza too- I think.
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ColinB
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2011 12:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rachel wrote:

Yeah I know pretty much all mobile phones track where they are in real time but they don't store it in a unsecure file for ever more on the phone or your PC...


How do you know? All mobile devices (such as the iPhone, iPad, Symbian, Android and Windows Mobile devices) that provide data communication services store data relative to their usage and share that data with "home" network servers and paired devices.

Even bog-standard mobile phones have to identify themselves in a Cell in order that the network knows where to route the incoming connections - whether voice or text. Are you assuming that this constantly-changing stream of data isn't stored somewhere in exactly the same way as your ISP stores all data relating to your online usage? These records are constantly requested by Police and Security services to determine the movements of criminal suspects - so how is that different to the "iPhone data" case?

And if we go back to good old-fashioned pre-cellular "fax" activity, all faxes that leave and enter the UK are cached by someone, somewhere. Who? Why? GCHQ perhaps? I appreciate that this is a slightly different scenario to iPhones and 3G iPads storing user GPS data internally and then synching it with one's "computer" back at base (for those that do this - an increasing number don't) but it isn't that far removed.

One thing that I'm grateful for is that if I lose my iPhone I can go online to Apple's "Mobile.Me" service and at the click of a couple of buttons not only can I detect where the unit is in the world (or the last location where it remained switched on) and if I choose I can, at the click of two buttons, permanently erase all the data in that device and render it completely useless to any user. It would take some real expertise to bring it back to life and effectively jailbreak it. It's hardly worth the time and effort.

OK, so my iPhone keeps an internal data file regarding my GPS data and that data is synched to my Apple Mac when I connect it or when the iPhone is within WiFi range of the Mac. Like Ian says, I can't say I'm really that bothered.

The far bigger concern is how our ISPs are forced by UK law to cache all connectivity data passing through the servers in what are known as the "ISP Black Boxes".

That's a much, much bigger concern - and that's why I still regard the whole iPhone data-caching issue as something of a non-story. The fact that Jezza apparently picked up on it says very little, given the sensationalist tabloid nature of the show.
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Rachel
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2011 5:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rachel wrote:
- they store it elsewhere though. Smile


Colin, quoting the little bit you missed would have saved you a lot of typing. Smile I already know all of that technical nonsense, but when deciding what is "news" I'll defer to the press and other media organisations.

I made a mistake- ( one for your diary- they don't come around very often) it wasn't on Jezza, it was on ITN and Channel 4 News. They made a big thing of it. The Jezza thing was about - just how nasty some people are on the internet- it described what goes on in here at times, perfectly. Smile
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Ian Robinson
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2011 7:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rachel wrote:
it was on ITN and Channel 4 News.

Blimey, they're even more sensationalist than Jeremy!
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RockitRon



Joined: 07 Dec 2006
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PostPosted: Fri May 06, 2011 7:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Slightly spookily, of all the 16,000 tracks on the ipod I took with me to Scotland last week, the one it played (on random shuffle) as soon as we crossed the border at Coldstream on the way up was Ken Bruce's Donald Where's Your Troosers!
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Rachel
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PostPosted: Fri May 06, 2011 9:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's quite funny Smile I like that.
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