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Radio 2 in the Park
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ColinB
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 12:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I really like the Proms in general but I always stay clear of the Last Night. I can't stand all that "Rule Britannia Rules the Waves" flag-waving jingoistic nonsense. I also prefer Elgar's "Pomp & Circumstance Opus 39" the way it should be heard!
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aviddiva



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PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 7:49 am    Post subject: Radio 2 in the Park Reply with quote

Wouldn't it have been great if PJ Harvey had replaced Lionel Ritchie?

Little bit of politics... Laughing
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PJ in Kent



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PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 6:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ColinB wrote:
I really like the Proms in general but I always stay clear of the Last Night. I can't stand all that "Rule Britannia Rules the Waves" flag-waving jingoistic nonsense.


Why???

Why shouldn't we be allowed to be proud of ourselves as a group of nations?
I'm sick of the pervading notion that anyone who waves a Union Jack (or Cross of St George for that matter)and loves their country is a knuckle-dragging bigoted moron. Cemeteries and battlefields after World War 1, 2 and beyond are full of men and women proud to stand up for their country and what they feel it stands for. That feeling persists today among normal, intelligent, moral and rational people.
To generalise them all in such a way is crass, insensitive and betrays a blinkered attitude.
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Toggy



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PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 9:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well said PJ, nothing wrong with being patriotic and feeling good about our identity.
The Last night is one of the few remaining things the PC brigade have not managed to stop yet and long may it stay that way.

I prefer part 4 of Pomp and Circumstance though. Very Happy
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ruddlescat



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 8:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would also echo PJ's sentiments - there is absolutely nothing wrong with our country being patriotic and proud although that is becoming more and more difficult because of interference from the liberal left politically correct brigade

There is a great deal in the history of our country to be proud of although of course not everything

When the Romans invaded Britain many people saw that as a disaster but in fact their culture left behind a lot of civilising influences just as our country has during its period of world domination which is now a distant memory

If you go into any public building in America you will see the Stars and Stripes proudly on display and the fact that the USA has done some debateable things around the world in the last century does not stop Americans from showing pride in their country and we need more of that attitude here in my view

My complaint about the recent Last Night is precisely that it did not stick to the proper traditions which many of us genuinely value and ended up being a watered down version of what has always been a proper demonstration of national pride

People come from all over the world to this event and the fact that some people here seem to view the event as over nationalistic certainly does not put them off

Perhaps that can be explained by the fact that in most of their countries they are used to demonstrations of national pride and identity so regard such things as perfectly normal whereas in this country the politically correct elite seem to want to constantly apologise for our country's history which to me is simply a sign of just how much life in this country has deteriorated over the last forty years
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essexlady



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 1:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is getting rather "political" isn't it? I have always thought that the strength and character of the British nation is a result of our ability to assimilate and benefit from other cultures i.e. Romans, Vikings, Normans, Hugenots etc. BUT I don't think that means that we shouldn't celebrate our multicultural nation either. I've no idea if this is view makes me a politically correct liberal, although I do think that one's attitude to political correctness ( and indeed Health and Safety) depends on your position in society e.g. whether you have been the victim of racial predudice or negligence by an employer. I'm always rather bemused by the scorn poured on "Elf and Safety" because in spite of the "compensation" culture it (or the lawyers) has encouraged I still feel that the resulting benefit of the decrease in the number of accidents and deaths makes it worthwhile. I still think that Britain is a wonderful, even if not perfect, country, and I've not visited any other place I would prefer to live.
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ruddlescat



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 2:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As a lawyer I've dealt with many cases involving both health and safety law and personal injury compensation and there is in my view absolutely nothing wrong with people standing up for their rights in such matters but I fail to see what relevance it has to the current subject under discussion

The Last Night of the Proms is a longstanding established British tradition and quite frankly if people take the trouble to come here from abroad to enjoy it which they do I can't see why on earth anyone in Britain whatever their ethnic origin should not feel able to support this historic annual occasion though of course whether individuals like the actual music chosen is very much a matter of personal preference

America is certainly a multicultural nation but there doesn't appear to be the hang ups about everyone celebrating their history and traditions there unlike in this country where many people appear scared stiff of causing offence to minority opinions Sad
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ColinB
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 2:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PJ in Kent wrote:
ColinB wrote:
I really like the Proms in general but I always stay clear of the Last Night. I can't stand all that "Rule Britannia Rules the Waves" flag-waving jingoistic nonsense.


Why???

Why shouldn't we be allowed to be proud of ourselves as a group of nations?


Because it's bloody ridiculous, that's why. People are living in the past. "Britannia Rules the Waves"? Get real, people. It has nothing to do with "patriotism" and everything to do with narrow-mindedness and stupidity. I'm patriotic, but I don't consider "Rule Britannia" (etc) to represent me at all. It's 2011 for heaven's sake, not 1750.
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PJ in Kent



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 4:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ColinB wrote:
PJ in Kent wrote:
ColinB wrote:
I really like the Proms in general but I always stay clear of the Last Night. I can't stand all that "Rule Britannia Rules the Waves" flag-waving jingoistic nonsense.


Why???

Why shouldn't we be allowed to be proud of ourselves as a group of nations?


Because it's bloody ridiculous, that's why. People are living in the past. "Britannia Rules the Waves"? Get real, people. It has nothing to do with "patriotism" and everything to do with narrow-mindedness and stupidity. I'm patriotic, but I don't consider "Rule Britannia" (etc) to represent me at all. It's 2011 for heaven's sake, not 1750.


So it's ridiculous to be proud of ourselves and our little group of islands, is it? What on earth is your basis for that intensely foolish generalisation???

Why is it narrow-minded and stupid to be proud of one's country and its traditions and culture, regardless of how far back we look? Is there a time limit on patriotism now then? "Sorry, everyone- we can only be deemed patriotically relevant if we celebrate British-ness post-1964." What a ridiculous, arrogant and over-bearing concept. Shocked
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ColinB
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 7:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

PJ in Kent wrote:
So it's ridiculous to be proud of ourselves and our little group of islands, is it? What on earth is your basis for that intensely foolish generalisation???


I said that to be singing "Rule Britannia, Britannia Rules The Waves" in 2011 is ridiculous. Read carefully.

It IS possible to be patriotic while considering such stuff absurd, you know.
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PJ in Kent



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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ColinB wrote:
PJ in Kent wrote:
So it's ridiculous to be proud of ourselves and our little group of islands, is it? What on earth is your basis for that intensely foolish generalisation???


I said that to be singing "Rule Britannia, Britannia Rules The Waves" in 2011 is ridiculous. Read carefully.

It IS possible to be patriotic while considering such stuff absurd, you know.


I did read carefully, thank you. Or was that your weak attempt at sarcasm?

In case you'd not noticed, we like to sing songs like Rule Britannia because of a thing called tradition, not because we still have a fleet of mighty warships commanding the globe. Rolling Eyes
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The Great Gildersleeve



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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 11:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, we were singing Jerusalem and Land Of Hope And Glory here too...
And Rule Britania(and that one is always done with some humour)
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ColinB
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2011 10:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

PJ in Kent wrote:
I did read carefully, thank you. Or was that your weak attempt at sarcasm?

In case you'd not noticed, we like to sing songs like Rule Britannia because of a thing called tradition, not because we still have a fleet of mighty warships commanding the globe. Rolling Eyes


It's "tradition" in the eyes of the blinkered few, let's be honest. It's a sad fact that are many, many British people who do genuinely think that Britain still "rules the waves".

And, as I wrote earlier, one can be proud of one's country without getting sucked in by all this jingoistic nonsense. Anyway, I maintain that the words of "Land of Hope & Glory" ruins a perfectly good musical work by Edward Elgar.
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aviddiva



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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2011 12:53 pm    Post subject: Radio 2 in the Park Reply with quote

'Rule Britannia' always has me thinking of the Bonzos' version - 'Britannia, you are cool - take a trip!'
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ColinB
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2011 2:50 pm    Post subject: Re: Radio 2 in the Park Reply with quote

aviddiva wrote:
'Rule Britannia' always has me thinking of the Bonzos' version - 'Britannia, you are cool - take a trip!'


Smile
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PJ in Kent



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PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2011 11:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ColinB wrote:
PJ in Kent wrote:
I did read carefully, thank you. Or was that your weak attempt at sarcasm?

In case you'd not noticed, we like to sing songs like Rule Britannia because of a thing called tradition, not because we still have a fleet of mighty warships commanding the globe. Rolling Eyes


It's "tradition" in the eyes of the blinkered few, let's be honest. It's a sad fact that are many, many British people who do genuinely think that Britain still "rules the waves".

And, as I wrote earlier, one can be proud of one's country without getting sucked in by all this jingoistic nonsense. Anyway, I maintain that the words of "Land of Hope & Glory" ruins a perfectly good musical work by Edward Elgar.


So I'm one of the blinkered few am I? And is jingoistic your word of the week?
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ColinB
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2011 11:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

PJ in Kent wrote:
So I'm one of the blinkered few am I? And is jingoistic your word of the week?


It's OK, you're by no means alone! (And, yes, "jingoistic" is indeed my word of the week simply because it aptly describes the silliness of the last night of the Proms).
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PJ in Kent



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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2011 9:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What a joyless existence it must be.........
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ColinB
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2011 10:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

PJ in Kent wrote:
What a joyless existence it must be.........


It's funny, but that's what a born-again Christian recently said to me once when I declared that I've been an atheist for 40 years. She said "You must live a joyless existence without god in your life". I told her that such a silly statement brought me much joy through laughter! Laughing
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PJ in Kent



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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2011 9:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ColinB wrote:
PJ in Kent wrote:
What a joyless existence it must be.........


It's funny, but that's what a born-again Christian recently said to me once when I declared that I've been an atheist for 40 years. She said "You must live a joyless existence without god in your life". I told her that such a silly statement brought me much joy through laughter! Laughing


So now the religious bear the brunt of your angst. I am an atheist (veering towards antitheism) but can readily accept that people are free to embrace whichever belief system they desire without fear of ridicule.
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ColinB
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2011 10:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PJ in Kent wrote:
So now the religious bear the brunt of your angst.


No angst. No ridicule. I'm just reflecting on your assumption that I live a "joyless existence" simply because I don't fall for all the jingoistic (yes, folks, it's my word of the week) nonsense. Hence the fact that I don't necessarily live a "joyless existence" simply because I don't believe in the existence of the christian god either!

PJ in Kent wrote:
I am an atheist (veering towards antitheism) but can readily accept that people are free to embrace whichever belief system they desire without fear of ridicule.


Bearing in mind my above comment, I'm not sure what that has to do with anything in the context.
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PJ in Kent



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PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 8:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ColinB wrote:
PJ in Kent wrote:
So now the religious bear the brunt of your angst.


No angst. No ridicule. I'm just reflecting on your assumption that I live a "joyless existence" simply because I don't fall for all the jingoistic (yes, folks, it's my word of the week) nonsense. Hence the fact that I don't necessarily live a "joyless existence" simply because I don't believe in the existence of the christian god either!

PJ in Kent wrote:
I am an atheist (veering towards antitheism) but can readily accept that people are free to embrace whichever belief system they desire without fear of ridicule.


Bearing in mind my above comment, I'm not sure what that has to do with anything in the context.


You were the one taking the initial dig at the religious because they didn't fall in with your beliefs.
And a joyless existence refers to your apparent lack of pleasure in anything unless it involves berating or belittling someone else....... If people like you are becoming prevalent on mb's like this one then I'll pass thanks.
The humour on here used to be great, but the displays of negativity and the "I know everything, everyone else is an idiot" posts are becoming depressing.
BYE ALL!
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ColinB
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 10:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

PJ in Kent wrote:
You were the one taking the initial dig at the religious because they didn't fall in with your beliefs.


Rubbish. I was reflecting on somebody's patronising comment ("you must live a joyless existence without god in your life") in response to my declaring that I was an atheist. Anybody who makes such a patronising comment deserves a sharp riposte, in my view.

How is that belittling? Who was asking them to "fall in with me"?

PJ in Kent wrote:
And a joyless existence refers to your apparent lack of pleasure in anything unless it involves berating or belittling someone else....... If people like you are becoming prevalent on mb's like this one then I'll pass thanks.


I don't see how such an assertion can be derived from the simple observation that I think that all the jingoistic nonsense on the Last Night at The Proms is not for me.

PJ in Kent wrote:
The humour on here used to be great, but the displays of negativity and the "I know everything, everyone else is an idiot" posts are becoming depressing.
BYE ALL!


Your choice. Bye.
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PJ in Kent



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PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 2:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PJ in Kent wrote:
The humour on here used to be great, but the displays of negativity and the "I know everything, everyone else is an idiot" posts are becoming depressing.
BYE ALL!


Your choice. Bye.[/quote]

I wasn't signing off to you, you self-important, narcissistic dullard- I was saying goodbye to all the decent, good-humoured souls on here... Cheers folks, most of it was fun! Wink
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